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Road Dogg On Being Jealous Of The Rock, Working Directly For Vince, DX vs. nWo
Road Dogg (@BGJames) is a WWE Hall of Famer known for his time as part of the tag team "The New Age Outlaws" and as a member of D-Generation X. He joins Chris Van Vliet to talk about his new podcast called "Oh... You Didn't Know", how he first teamed up with his tag team partner Billy Gunn, his thoughts on Gunn Club in AEW being compared to the New Age Outlaws, his struggles with addiction, how he was able to get clean, what he learned working under Vince McMahon as the head writer on Smackdown, his relationship with Triple H, why he was jealous of The Rock and much more!
For more information about Chris and INSIGHT go to: https://podcast.chrisvanvliet.com
“I don’t remember the date, but I remember that it was on a house show. The Underfaker, Brian Lee, he always was a great friend of mine, and we always used to mess around. He was like ‘You better fax somebody.’ Or ‘You better Page somebody.’ We were saying all kind of different stuff. So one night we were backstage and he came and he unbuttoned my tag titles. I turned around and I was mad and like ‘When I get back here…’ And he was like ‘Oh you better call somebody!’ I said ‘Oh OK,OK.’ And then I went out there, the music went [sings first bars of theme song] and I went ‘Oh you didn’t know?’ It was totally just to make the one guy laugh that I had been messing with. But it sounded so decent between the guitar riffs so I was like I’m going to try that again. And then the rest is just history.”
“I do see some [of myself and Billy Gunn] in them, and that is kind of weird of me to say and weird for me to feel that way. But I see Austin [as myself] but the difference is that he can work too. I wasn’t a very good athlete, I was just entertaining I guess. But both of his kids are great athletes, it’s just that Austin is out there a bit more. Colten just kind of brings home the bacon, he just does what he has to do. I see some similar things in what they do, and I have actually talked a couple of times with them about coming up with something. It can’t be like what we did, but coming up with some like sing-songy thing. Like when you are a heel, it’s like the Kurt Angle you suck thing, we are trying to do something like that.”
“Oh man, I think I stole that from the Ringman brothers. You know like when you come to a fayre like ‘Ladies and gentleman, boys and girls, children of all ages…’ It was just like a carnival barker. Basically it was just that which I modified to fit mine and Billy’s names. I would tweak it each week for the town name. You give them the sing-song part that they can holler at you, but then you tweak it to make it personalised for that city.”
“All I can say is thank God for the researchers. Half of the time I don’t remember the stuff before I read through the notes. But they schedule out what we are going to talk about, I wouldn’t even know where to begin.”
“The one I was scared to talk about was the VKM one. Not because we were them, it was just a dark time in my life. It was like do I really want to live that? The one that we just did was with Billy and his kids. I hope it turns out as fun as we had recording it. Sometimes you can have a wrestling show that was fun and it was a great show, but then you look at the ratings.”
“I think they actually like it because it is something. It is something that people can get behind. But to their credit, they sell it, because that is what they are supposed to do. If they didn’t do that, I don’t think the crowd would chant.”
“I honestly do think that was the case. I do remember stuff when I start reading about it, it will bring stuff back. But I don’t know where my head was at. I did a lot of foolish things, crazy bumps, crazy chair shots, a lot of crazy stuff. Who can pinpoint who doesn’t make me smart, but there is something there.”
“Yeah, it was, I didn’t have a job at the time and I was riding back with my brother from an independent show in upper Alabama. We just drove up and drove back, and I had got a bunch of pills, because I am still the Road Dogg at the indie show, still a big deal. So they gave me all of the pills and wanted to share with me, and I got hammered. On the ride back I was really down on myself and on life, and messed up. My brother Scott just got clean at rehab, they paid for it. He said ‘You can call Anne Russo.’ Who was in charge of the wellness policy at the time. I called that day, I don’t know if I was ready to quit doing drugs and alcohol, just to do something. So I called her and she set me right up, but by the 28th day, I didn’t know how to stop living that way. I didn’t know how to get off of the roller coaster. I didn’t care for a while, I didn’t care which handful of pills killed me, my only problem in my mind was that my kids would find me dead. That is what kept me from doing it and when Scotty told me to go to rehab. And thank God I did, I only went for 28 days. But if you are ready to quit living like that, you’ll take suggestions and quit living like that. But you have to get ready, no human or place will get you there, you have to get there and be ready.”
“100%. In the program of recovery I follow, there is some making amends parts to it. I had to make that list, Jim Ross was one, The Rock was one, The Undertaker was one, these are guys that tried to help me. Well Rock didn’t try to help me but I was mean to him because I was jealous of him and he was a threat to me, because he could do everything that I could do, but he looked friggin great too. It was like, son of a bee sting, you’ve got everything. And at that time it bothered me, because he was a threat to me, so I treated him horribly in front of everybody all of the time. I went to him and he said ‘Thank you, that’s nice to say.’ I don’t know if he does forgive me, that’s none of my business. But I had to do it to clean up my side of the street. Jim Ross, I treated him badly too because he dealt with all the contract side of stuff. The Undertaker, he tried to help me but I went ‘You ain’t my daddy. You don’t know nothing about me.’ It was just where I was at the time, and I don’t have to be there anymore.”
“Oh yeah, I still keep in touch with Taker. Every time I see Rock we talk, he came to the Performance Center when I was down there and watched some matches. It helps me lay my head on my pillow at night. The more I can figure out what is more my fault, the better I can sleep at night.”
“It was. It was at the time. But people change, people who say they don’t are wrong. At that moment in my life, I would have fought both of them at the drop of a hat, and I don’t even know why. The drug and alcohol addiction is very self centered and very selfish. It was very much all about me, why didn’t you stand up for me and why didn’t you keep me on? But I would have fired me too, because I was a liability. But at that moment, how dare you? You son of a guns. When Vince Russo came aboard and said do you want to do this thing? I was like, I will do whatever to keep the lights on and to keep my drug habit going. That was basically my whole tenure there.”
“Let me tell you something, Vince has never watched an episode of TNA ever in his whole life. But Hunter said something to me, it was in Baltimore and I will never forget it. He said ‘Hey Dogg, what’s going on?’ We had just seen each other for the first time and it was like come on in. I went into his office and he went ‘So what’s this VKM thing?’ I was like I am so sorry, he said ‘I’m just kidding, don’t worry about it.’ And that was it. I think everyone gets that you go over there and you just do what they say. But it was personal at the time, and I believe that VKM TNA was some of my best mic work. There were some really good promos I cut down there that I didn’t even realize until I did the podcast. I was like holy crap they gave me some mic time.”
“Yeah it’s a little bit different because they are not going head to head. It almost feels like not a war but another wrestling show being on. I know that they are watching the higher ups, maybe Punk, are following the ratings. But I think the boys are just loving that they have a place to work. I’m just a boy that chased a dream into millions of dollars, but I don’t think the boys are in as much of a competition as the boys are. I think the boys are just happy to be paid to take the bumps.”
“I came to him and I said ‘So and so wants to say this in their promo, but it’s not what we wrote in the promo, are you ok with that?’ He said ‘Does it get the same point across?’ I said that it did and he said ‘Yeah Brian, do that and the talent will trust you more. It empowers them.’ He told me that on a one on one basis, because sometimes he writes the promo and that’s what you say if he can’t fully trust you to go out there live and do and act accordingly and do your promo in a professional way, because he doesn’t trust you yet. I think this was Dolph Ziggler to be honest, it’s one of those things where it’s like I trust Dolph, but then he shoots himself in the foot! But I love Dolph and I would have loved to see him teaming with Billy Gunn in his prime. Holy crap man, The Suicide Blonds or something.”
“Dude you sit under that learning tree and sometimes you sit under it until 3 in the morning. It was where you learn stuff and little stuff, not just about the business but being an executive. He had somebody coming to the office once a week from Carnegie to teach me how to be an executive. He wanted to make me an executive and work it, to the point where I couldn’t handle it. To work with that man is difficult, not because of how he is, but because of who he is. He will work all night and be the first one up in the morning to get to work the next day. One time we got in late, we were doing Monday Night Raw and then SmackDown on Tuesday. We flew to the next town and landed at 2am. I just wanted to go to my bed, we get off the place and he says ‘Brian, you got SmackDown?’ I said ‘Yes sir.’ I sit down and pull it out, we go over it, and then I said ‘Sir, I would like to talk about this in the morning.’ He threw it back in my lap and said ‘You’re going to regret that!’ I look over to Kevin Dunn and I said ‘Oh God I am going to regret that.’ And Kevin said ‘You should.’ Next morning he called me early and I went to his room, but I got some sleep so it didn’t matter. But he is a workhorse and I couldn’t keep up. My sobriety was a white knuckle and I just couldn’t keep up, that’s how it was in the WWE, I couldn’t handle it. That’s why I went to NXT for a little while because I thought I could skate for a little bit and I did. Then for business decisions they needed to trim some fat. Hey, it’s no secret that I got fat, it’s a business decision. I called him after to thank him. Not only did he employ me for 10 years, he paid for my rehab and for my brother. If you are bitter at that guy, something is wrong with you.”
“I don’t know that. I would love that, but at this stage in my life, knowing what I know now, I don’t know if I could take that. It’s not that if I could, but also if I want to. I was there for a decade, I’ve only been gone for a few months but it feels good. Nick Patrick said it best when he said that it feels like getting out of prison. It felt like a weight was lifted off my shoulders, but it’s like what do I do now.”
“I get that, they came at the same time. I just think one of them, of course I am biased because I was in one, but we were more distinct. They added people at every chance that they got and split into different things. I liked it when it was just Hogan and The Outsiders. Then it was Bischoff and Bagwell and Dennis Rodman, it felt like it was bastardised. I am biased but I thought that we were cooler.”
“Family and friends, the health of my family and sobriety.”
